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  • penelope4
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    • Total Posts: 124

    Well, I started to write that I don’t intend to ask him to do anything because he won’t come and I can’t take any more rejection from him…. but as I was typing I realized that even telling him that I’m leaving and getting a non-reaction hasn’t given me closure. I thought it would but no, there’s still that voice inside that says, “this isn’t over.” Nothing else to do. Apparently, I need to be humiliated and slapped in the face.

    So until I reach that “goal”, I guess I’m starting to put things in motion. I know you’re all waiting for the Big Talk but I’m not a normal person in regards to putting myself out there – ESPECIALLY after the bad treatment and rejections he gave me last summer – so it was a pretty big deal that I told him I’m leaving and I’d like your thoughts on that…

    He totally ignored what I said last night. This “reaction” was quite different from two other previous times when I hinted that I might leave Italy. The first time, last summer, before I left for the States, his coworker said, “F, come here. Penelope is going to America and she wants to say goodbye”. He stopped dead in his tracks and looked like he’d been stung, then realized he meant I was going on vacation and asked, “what are you bringing me back?” The second time – on that crazy marathon day last September – he said he might ask me to teach a course at his school next year. When I said, “If I’m still here next year” he got really snippy and said, “well, fine, then I guess we’ll just do nothing since you’re just going to leave”. He was visibly relieved when I said I was just kidding.

    But last night, nothing. We were having a nice chat. He was tired but in a good mood; we were talking about cooking and he was trying to make me laugh by imitating a tuba (so silly…). I told him my computer is totally fried and he was telling me how I could fix it but I said, “I’ll just buy a new one when I move” – no reaction, just kept telling me how I could fix it. I tried again: “I can’t do anything with it anymore. It won’t even let me send out CVs because I can’t attach files” – nothing. A bit later, another musician came over to us and started trying to talk to me; F went to go do some work. The musician assumed I was a tourist and asked when I was going back to my country and I – out of force of habit – snapped irritably: “I live here. I’ve lived here for the past 5 years” (I HATE being mistaken for a tourist). The musician asked if I’m planning on living here forever. F was walking past us and I said, “I’m in the process of moving back.” The musician said, “Oh!” like he was disappointed but then he said, “Well, that’s exciting anyway.” From F – Nothing.

    I guess didn’t so much TELL him as I hinted at it, tried to plant seeds but still… like it went totally over his head. No acknowledgment. He does that sometimes. He always does that when I give him a compliment, and he did that a lot last summer when I tried to bring up things from when we dated. Things that make him uncomfortable? So either he didn’t catch my hints (which I doubt) or the thought of me leaving makes him uncomfortable? Or he doesn’t give a shit.

    penelope4
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    • Total Posts: 124

    No. We were at school, he was at the reception desk, people in and out, some other guy was trying to talk to me. F eventually left the room.

    penelope4
    Participant
    • Total Posts: 124

    I talked to him tonight. We had a nice chat. I told him 3 times, in 3 different ways, that I’m planning on leaving: he completely ignored me each time. just kept the conversation going like he hadn’t even caught what i said.

    penelope4
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    • Total Posts: 124

    Nope.

    I was going to tell him that I’m leaving this week, but then my piano lesson was canceled because the teacher was feeling sick. So I’ll tell him Monday, at my next lesson.

    there are moments where I think I’m over him… and then something happens where I realize that I’m not. I’m very confused about my feelings for him at this point. Telling him that I’m leaving will pull the band aid off and really start the detachment process.

    I’ll let you know how it goes.

    penelope4
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    • Total Posts: 124

    There are no plans. I’m half heartedly looking for jobs and am getting nowhere.

    I do not intend to ask him out. He doesn’t like it when i do. I guess i am hoping for one of our encounters where he is open and happy to see me. My therapist thinks i need to tell him i’m leaving. She thinks that is what will give me the closure i need to move on. She thinks i haven’t fully committed to leaving because i’m still holding on to the idea of there being a chance; that that’s why i haven’t told him i’m planning to leave.

    I feel very numb to him lately. I’m mad that he’s so weird and treats people badly when he is stressed. I’m a good person. I deserve to be treated well consistently.

    I will probably see him tonight.

    penelope4
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    • Total Posts: 124

    Okay, so it’s not just me reading too much into it then? I’ve been asking myself if he’s just stressed/insane and his weird behavior has nothing to do with me, but it does seem like that weirdness was pointed at me, right? Even if you’re stressed, you say hi to people normally, right? Especially if you’re supposed to be friends. But he was deliberately pretending like he didn’t see me – why? And then later on! I thought maybe he was cranky because he was trying to work and his friends and I were distracting him but 1) it was Js idea to bring me in there which he wouldn’t have done if he knew F was on a tight deadline 2) D was working with F and he had no problems talking to us 3) I was actually the quietest person in the room; it was more his friends who were making noise. And yet, he told ME to leave. So wtf?

    I can’t tell if he’s just a moody son of a bitch with mental problems (I have recently seen him ignoring other people when they try to interact with him) or it’s something I’ve done. I KNOW that there’s an affection between us that doesn’t go away, despite him acting at times like I matter nothing. It’s like it gets buried under so much background noise. Maybe this is a good thing to lead off with when I talk to him – a starter topic that could potentially open the door to telling him everything?

    penelope4
    Participant
    • Total Posts: 124

    Hi, Starlight, thank you for the concern. The news about Paris has everyone freaked out; are there any safe places left in the world?

    Kaila, as I was writing that thing about “nurturing my self respect” it struck me that by doing so, I am also limiting occasions to see him outside of school and possibly have “the talk.” I guess it’s a fine line between desperately hunting him/hanging around him and closing myself off.

    Why does he act this way? I don’t know. My therapist used to think it was because he was reacting to my behavior but I’m no longer so sure I have any effect on him. Yes, it’s true that we both have ALWAYS had a hard time being consistently cool around each other but I have reasons, dammit. I have never had this experience with anyone else. A friend is consistently chill and happy to see you, right?

    I don’t know if he’s just stressed out about something in his life (work? more drama with his ex?) and it’s making him act weird, but he’s definitely been nervous these past couple of weeks. We have had some nice one-on-one encounters in the past month (chatting in front of the perfume shop, hanging out alone listening to music while he tried to play a song I like on the bass; him showing me how to play the guitar) so I don’t think he’s upset with me or disgusted by me. Last Tuesday was weird …. I know I promised I wouldn’t give play-by-plays anymore but this is just to give you an idea of what I’m talking about by “weird”:

    I got to school and he was hanging out in the front by himself. As I approached, I saw him look at me for a second, but then he pretended not to notice me; he just kept staring up at the air ducts. I got to the door, two feet away from him, but he kept pretending he didn’t see me. Finally I said, “Ahem. HEY.” He pretended to finally notice me and smiled: “Oh, hi.” I said, “What are you looking at up there in the air ducts?” He said, “Oh, there’s so much to do around here…” He was clearly nervous and there was this awkward tension between us and I thought, “this is stupid” so I said, “Okay. Well, enjoy. See you later” and I went inside to do my lesson. Later when I came out, his friend J – WHO IS ALWAYS NORMAL AND HAPPY TO SEE ME – asked me if I wanted to see the movie short that he and F are writing the soundtrack for. I said okay. J took me inside the office, where F and D (another musician) were working on dubbing some tracks. D – WHO IS NORMAL – said hello to me immediately. F – WHO IS NOT NORMAL – pretended I wasn’t there. J and I watched the video; from time to time D came over to talk to us. After the video finished, D and J continued talking, and then another musician, PG, came in and started teasing me. F was pretending to clean the equipment – he pretends to clean when he’s anxious – and not acknowledging us. Finally, I had to go home so I told everyone goodnight – PG and J hugged and kissed me goodnight, because they are NORMAL. I said, “F. Goodnight. I like the music you and J wrote.” He said, “Thanks,” – again, not turning to look at me.

    “How are you?” I said.
    “Fine.”
    “Really? I wouldn’t know. I only see the back of you.”
    He turned his head halfway to the side and smiled: “I must kindly ask you to leave. I have work to do.”
    “Okay,” I said.

    And I went home.

    penelope4
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    • Total Posts: 124

    No news. the correct situation in which to tell him has not occurred. in the meantime, I’m working on the detachment process, i.e., not breaking my neck to create meaningful encounters with him at school and not going to places where he’ll be solely in hopes of running into him. For example, right now I’m fighting the urge to go to a concert where he’ll be. His friends – who are normal people, unlike him – told me i should go but I’m tired (got back from lisbon last night at 2 a.m. and worked all day today). the only reason i’d go to that thing is the thought of being able to interact with him so no! i’m staying home and nurturing my self respect. i’m trying not to let him control my movements anymore.

    it is hard. for so long i blamed myself for having ruined things between us. those horrible years when we didn’t talk i made myself a promise. i said, “if he ever gives me a clear sign that he wants to be in my life again, i will never let him go.” i still feel the residues of the desire to keep that promise. finally understanding that he doesn’t return my feelings and isn’t the right man for me helps me let go, but i’m still very confused about how to act around him.

    we’re both really skittish around each other lately. more him than me. i don’t really have any questions left about our relationship or whatever you want to call it, but the only thing i wonder is why he can’t be consistently normal around me. i know that he enjoys spending time with me and even feels some affection for me so why so damn weird and awkward? i know i haven’t been kissing his ass as usual – i spend more time chatting with the other musicians and why? because they are normal, fun, and consistently happy to see me!!!! – but i still make the effort to say hi to F and be nice to him. and yet, super awkward. either he’s schizophrenic or there’s something i’m missing.

    penelope4
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    • Total Posts: 124

    Brief update: haven’t told him yet, haven’t had the opportunity. i will do it for the closure. but i don’t really have any questions left. i feel like i understand what happened in the past and what is happening now, which is a first. Halloween was awful; it just reinforced the fact that our “connection” is important to me, but not to him. I no longer believe that there is magic in the world.

    wanted to get your opinions, though; how should I BE around him until I can get him alone to tell him? I see him at school or sometimes at events but, as you know, our interactions run from hot to cold and I’m never sure which F I’m going to get. He swings so dramatically from warm, interested and affectionate to awkward and nervous. For my part, I am throwing out mixed signals like CRAZY with him lately. I try to treat him like any other dude so I talk/joke with all the guys at music school but there’s still a part of me that can’t help showing him that I care or that I’m interested in him the most. I’m confused.

    I saw him tonight and he was weird; first, giving me interested friendly looks when I teased him – like he wanted to tease me as well but was for some reason holding back – and then being a cold jerk later. Maybe it has nothing to do with me, maybe he’s just a weird jerk! But it sure doesn’t make it easy to think about telling him what I want to say.

    penelope4
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    • Total Posts: 124

    Hi, Teresa. Don’t know if you’ll see this but I wanted to say that I’m glad you feel like you got some closure with G. I also wanted to thank you for having taken an interest in my story and for your insights. I hope we both end up finding what we’re looking for….

    penelope4
    Participant
    • Total Posts: 124

    Kaila, you’re definitely not being rude. I know very well how frustrating my back-and-forth swinging can be. Imagine my therapist, who has been dealing with this for 3 years! And I’m sick of myself, too… it’s very hard to live this way.

    I don’t want to stay in Italy without the prospect of being with him and, no, I don’t truly want this to continue indefinitely. That’s the fear talking. But it really would be a terrible idea to move back to the States without a secure job. My home country is expensive as hell and I’ve been living on Italian wages for the past few years…

    You all have been so incredibly supportive and helpful; Kaila, your insight has been utterly invaluable. What I really appreciate is that you all seem to respect the relationship he and I once had. I know it was a million years ago but it has impacted me so profoundly. It’s nice to hear other people say that maybe I could have meant something to him, too, even if it was long ago.

    I’ll try to keep the waffling to a minimum on here but bear with me; this is five years that is coming to a close. I’ve been consumed with terror over this man – first of intimacy and then of rejection – for so long. Sometimes closing the chapter seems just as scary as the rejection. Yes, I’m basically a walking ball of fear. This is not behavior that is fit for a 35 year-old woman.

    Tell him I love him first. Okay. I’ve gone through a couple of potential scenarios in my head as to how this conversation might come about but I’m trying not to make master plans; it’s been my experience that things with him never go down the way I expect. I guess right now I’m more kind of thinking of what I want to tell him.

    penelope4
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    • Total Posts: 124

    Do I like my current relationship with him? 20% of the time.
    Can I live my life without regrets or remorse or negative feelings with the current relationship? No, although I have to admit I don’t really wonder “what if” anymore because I now know he isn’t there.
    Am I happy with how things are right now? No. I can’t even enjoy the nice moments we share anymore because I don’t trust them, nor do I want to let myself fall back into the trap of thinking there’s something between us. I’ve gotten a lot better about not reading into things that he does or says in relation to me. And I no longer see our encounters as part of a narrative that leads to us being together. That story has been ripped apart and I can’t remember the words.

    I know I have to do something. I know it’s for me, about getting the closure. But keep in mind, it’s been five years. I almost don’t remember what life was like before knowing him. Five years and I still love him. It’s so hard to let go of the idea that we will end up together, and to imagine never seeing him again. But I’ve lived without him in my life before; I need to find the courage to do it again.

    penelope4
    Participant
    • Total Posts: 124

    Teresa – facebook is the WORST! But remember, the thing about facebook is that it’s just photos. People post what they want to convey, not what actually is. How many people do you know who are going through crappy times and yet only post photos of themselves at parties, as though their lives are a blast? I myself don’t have a relationship status on my FB because there’s no “broken-hearted/doomed to die alone” option… but my feed is just pictures of food, music videos, and funny stories about my students or writing. From FB, you could never tell that I cry myself to sleep nearly every night.

    That picture isn’t the full story of what’s happening with H and your ex. Nor is it the full story of what’s happening with you and H. But I’m starting to notice a pattern in all of this; you, to keep your ex and P happy, keep quiet about your relationship with your ex. You, to keep your ex, P AND H happy, don’t say anything to H about your relationship with your ex. It seems like you have a habit of sacrificing what you want to try to please other people and get NO benefits from doing so. At least this particular crew!

    My feeling is that H knows about you and the ex. I could be totally off base, but like you said, it does seem weird that for the first time ever H can’t hang out with you and that he’s hanging out with your ex instead of you today. Sure, it’s the ex’s birthday, but there was a time when you’d have been at the soccer match, too, right? And H’s email to you seems overly detailed, which I’d take to be an indication of guilt (so at least there’s that).

    I think it’s time to stop bending over backwards to please these dorks and take care of yourself.

    penelope4
    Participant
    • Total Posts: 124

    Well, if I don’t find a job in the next two months I’m not going anywhere.

    I’m worried about ruining our current relationship – whatever you want to call it. we’re not real friends; i don’t know what we are. there could be negative consequences, like him feeling the need to be cold to me or being (even more) awkward around me. he’ll be uncomfortable/upset for sure when i tell him. i’d hate to have to quit music school, because i really enjoy going there, and not just for him anymore.

    penelope4
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    • Total Posts: 124

    You don’t think it’s too much information all at once?

Viewing 15 posts - 16 through 30 (of 122 total)