August 30, 2020 at 11:49 pm #115477
I(29) was together with my now ex (27) for 7 and a half years. Engaged for 2. There were moments where she had episodes of depression and panic attacks but it got left untreated. She had a lot of trouble with finding and keeping a stable job which causes a lot of arguments. The past year I’ve been acting more ungrateful because she was not putting in any effort of getting a job. Communication from her side was very poor because she is shy and introverted and an avoidant type.
A few months ago, during COVID, she said she was going back to her home country for a while (which is Latvia, I’m Belgian, and we lived here together). She clearly missed her family very much, so I let her go. She also wanted to see a therapist while she was there, which I thought was a great idea. After her therapy sessions, she said she wanted to talk on the phone, which we rarely do, and that put me on edge. Contact was also becoming very infrequent while she was there. I was already seeing a breakup coming. On the phone, she mentioned how we were fighting a lot recently and how my family issues were affecting her. She wanted to go “on a sort of break”. I got needy and clingy and pushy and told her I can also go see a psychologist and move to Latvia for her. Of course, this did nothing to better my situation. I asked her if this meant we should see other people, and she said she wasn’t going to go out and date but if I find a nice girl I should “go for it”. My heart broke in half and I told her she was the only one for me and asked her if she could really see me dating other girls. She said no. Again, I was not emotionally stable and was speaking out of fear and not rationally.
After that conversation, I send her a message saying I would give her space and to contact me when she feels ready. I then started researching and applying No Contact.
I also started seeing a psychologist so I could prepare myself for a breakup and become less insecure. I started working out and meditation.
4 weeks of No Contact went by and then I received a text saying that she wanted to break up and needs to be alone for a bit. I told her I understood and thanked her for an amazing 8 years. We talked it out a bit saying how our relationship was unhealthy for a while and that couples counseling wouldn’t work. She didn’t feel emotionally healthy for that. After a few days I initiated contact to talk about her phone plan I was still paying for, she said she’ll send it back and that her mother asked for some stuff back that had sentimental values. I told her no problem and asked for the address and anything else she wanted back. She said she was going to think about it. During that conversation I also asked her if there were no hard feelings and she said “Theres no hard feelings, ill really miss you, hope we can be friends one day”. I joked how I would start a sex change now (send her a picture from faceswapp), to which she responded very positively.
That was our last interaction which was exactly 2 weeks ago, I haven’t received the address for shipping because it wasn’t urgent. Now I’m very confused about where I am in the process. I already applied no contact pre-breakup (Which in hindsight I could’ve done differently maybe. I don’t know). Should I reapply it? Should I go in minimal contact? She is a very shy person and will never reach out to me. Do I wait until she feels emotionally better before I start building up more frequent texting? I also found out about the elephant in the room text, I was thinking of sending her this at some point (After No Contact):
“Honestly, a part of me still wants you back but I’m okay with whatever happens. I understand why we broke up and I’ve learned a lot from it.
I’ve realized that it is kind of good that it happened because I’m able to see things differently now.
I feel good right now and I’m texting you just because I miss being in touch with you. I’m just interested in seeing what happens.”
So yeah I feel a bit in empty waters here. I feel our breakup is pretty unique because there’s a lot of factors here that aren’t that common. But I also feel things could be resolved if she would allow it. I’m considering the long term plan where I get in shape, emotionally stable, get my driver’s license, and reach out to her in 4 – 6 months to see how she feels. I don’t want to scare her introverted nature. I want her to get better and feel happy with her family. But I don’t want to lose her out of my life. We were already planning on moving together to Latvia so that is still definitely an option for me in the future.
What do I do?August 31, 2020 at 6:37 am #115480
@soupcat I know you were together 7 1/2 years, but how long did you live together?? When did she go back to Latvia??
You say after her therapy sessions, she wanted to talk on the phone. How long was she in therapy and is she finished now?? Is she taking any prescribed medication now for her depression and panic attacks??
How could your family issues affect her??
You wrote:”We talked it out a bit saying how our relationship was unhealthy for a while and that couples counseling wouldn’t work. She didn’t feel emotionally healthy for that.” Couples counseling has helped many people, but her comment that she didn’t feel emotionally healthy for that is disturbing. Apparently her therapy sessions have not helped to stabilize her depression/emotions/thinking patterns!! It seems she wasn’t in therapy long enough to do much good..
You’ve already told her that she’s the only girl for you so she knows you love her. Don’t say anymore about love, moving to Latvia, or talking about reuniting. She has to work out her own issues before she would be able to appreciate more texting or consider reconciling.
Continue no contact and wait for the address to send what she wants. At that time, if she doesn’t know you’re seeing a psychologist to work through and cope with your issues, you could tell her.
Do not send this part of your note:”I feel good right now and I’m texting you just because I miss being in touch with you. I’m just interested in seeing what happens.” Say instead, I miss communicating with you and would like to text more often if you’re okay with it..
7 1/2 years is a long time to be together with her and I’m sure she still has strong feelings for you, but she needs time to miss you and time to get better mentally. Sounds like you can be a patient person with your long term plan.
PS: How did you indent the paragraph?
Wishing you good luck:)August 31, 2020 at 10:45 am #115481
Thank you for your reply!
To answer your questions:
She actually moved in with me within the first 3 or 4 months or so if I remember correctly. She was living with a family as an au pair at that time, so she never really lived by herself. I remember it being really fast but also feeling really right. So we’ve honestly lived together during all this time except for the first few months. She went back to Latvia the 29th of June, so almost exactly 2 months ago. Before that we went every year to visit her family around the holidays.
I also made a mistake. She hasn’t been doing therapy for that long. It was only after the first session that we had the call.3 weeks after she left she said “I have my first appointment tomorrow” and I told her good luck. When I asked her how it went, she didn’t reply for an entire day. In the evening she texted me saying that she cried a lot during the session and has a lot to think about and to call on Friday. Now she never discussed how often she’s doing these therapy sessions, and I don’t really want to ask her. She needs to do this on her own. I hope she gets medication.
About my family. She was always very close with my sister and my mother. When we first started dating she took care of my younger sister who was 7 at the time. Babysitting and picking her up from school. My mom is a single mom. But now recently during COVID there were a lot of problems with my sister. A lot of fighting between her and my mother which escalated into physical fights. My ex was very sensitive to this and my mother kept calling her and me to help with the situation and deal with it. This was a boundary issue on my part and I should’ve stopped it. I know better now.
At some point my sister stayed with us for 3 weeks because it got so intense. She also ended up creating drama at our place. This annoyed my ex immensely and said “I am done with this shit” frequently.
So yeah, she hasn’t been in therapy for that long (a month or two now supposedly) and I don’t know how intense the sessions. I am fully aware that she needs to sort herself out for now. Weather this is 3 months or 6 months. I totally understand. I need to get a very clear signal that she feels better before I start reconciling. Thank you for this advice. She needs to stop associating me with her depression and anxieties. I’m very afraid she sees me or the relationship as the cause. She’s definitely a fearful attachment and I’m a anxious attachment, and I read these two types can cause depression due to needs not being met.
Thank you so much for your reply, this will help me put my mind at rest and get some clarity on the situation. People keep saying I should move on and forget about her, but it’s hard because I care about her well being. I can’t just turn those emotions off. People keep saying “Its not your concern anymore”, which I find a bit insulting. She’s still a person I can care about.
But I will definitely keep my distance because this is the last she needs right now and I’m patient enough to let her handle this. I still want to make amends for my mistakes but that’s for way down the line. The same with the elephant in the room message, this is for when contact goes better.
I’ll tell her about the psychologist even though I have no idea how to phrase it without showing off or it being unnatural. I’ll think about this.
Again thank you this helps so much. I can finally focus on myself a bit now.
I did the indent by using the button next to “LINK” >>> B-QUOTEAugust 31, 2020 at 4:20 pm #115482
@soupcat Wow, I can understand why your family situation was causing much drama! But as I’m sure you know, your mother and sister need to work through their own problems. Of course you wanted to help, but the work has to be done between the two.. Sounds like therapy of some sort would be to their advantage.
I believe only a medical doctor or psychiatrist can prescribe medications for your ex. Hopefully she will be diagnosed properly and the proper medication for her condition would surly be very helpful.
As to mentioning your therapy with the psychologist just write “By the way, I started seeing a psychologist to help me work through my behavioral issues” or something like that. You need to be prepared about what to say as she might contact you anytime to give the address where to send her things..
I’m trying the indentation:) When you mention the psychologist you could also apologize for any part you played in the breakup.
Good luck and let of know of any updates..August 31, 2020 at 5:35 pm #115484
Haha I can see you figured it out!
My mother and sister their issues was indeed something that never should’ve entered our lives, they were in counseling at the time (still are) and my mother has a way of just pushing her problems onto others. I’ve started making boundaries with her now, but obviously its a bit late now. I really didn’t see how affected she was by this and I feel like a fucking idiot.
I was indeed going to say something along the lines of how on edge I was due to work, and that I’m happy I started seeing someone to deal with my own issues.
When she initially broke up with me I apologized at that moment already. Should I apologize again? I mean, I keep finding new things to be sorry for. I have entire letters written in my journal I could send to her (which I wont, obviously). The last apology I sent when she broke up with me was this:
No but euhm. I really need to tell you how sorry I am. I’ve been going through our texts of the past year and I’m honestly disgustes with myself and the person I turned into. I don’t know what the fuck happened but, this was not ok. I don’t expect you to forgive me, but I just needed to tell you. I’m truly sorry.
That’s when she said that “Our relationship was unhealthy for a while i think. It was hard to see from inside but taking a step back was an eye opener” To which I suggested couples therapy which she didn’t feel she could handle.
If I’d apologize again, I would have something like this lined up (its way too much so I think id need to trim the fat but its whats on my mind):
“Alright I’ll send it asap. I hope you’re doing well! 🙂 I started seeing a psychologist the past weeks and it seems I’ve been super on edge for a long time due to work. I really needed to talk to someone.
I also want to apologize again for all the times I didn’t acknowledge your depression. For all the times I took you for granted and didn’t hear your problems out. For all the times I didn’t stop talking about work and used you as a vent to just complain. For all the times I complained when I wasn’t happy with the food that you so lovingly made. For blowing up out of nowhere and starting arguments that were not productive.”
This would be in a reply of the address. I feel this is bringing up things and reminding her of bad parts of the relationship. So I have no fucking clue what I’m doing here. It also feels like I’m begging for forgiveness this way.
Thank you for your response. I hope I hear from her at some point and she’s not just ghosting me. But the longer we don’t talk. The better it feels. Part of me feels a bit jealous and anxious she might go out and have sex with other men, but at the same time I feel ok with it because we’re not together anymore.September 1, 2020 at 4:00 am #115486
@soupcat Wow.. you really messed up and didn’t treat her very well. She had her flaws too, but you also created a lot of tension and unhappiness for her. Most couples want serenity and happiness during a relationship. Both have a right to express themselves, but to harp on any particular subject is damaging/destructive to their union. But it sounds like you’ve learned a valuable lesson and therefore won’t make the same mistakes again:)
I don’t know what your first apology contained, but if it covered everything in a general sense, it’s enough for now. Yes, apologizing for each and every detail might immediately cause her to think of all the things that caused her to be unhappy.
You don’t need to say you needed to talk to someone! Just maybe say you started seeing a psychologist because you were stressed with work for a long time and want help to address and process all your negative thoughts and behaviors. And stop using the word fuck when writing to her..
Good luck.September 17, 2020 at 12:32 pm #115520
It’s been exactly 30 days since I last interacted with her. And after I posted an artwork of mine on Instagram I received a text from her asking how I am doing. She hasn’t mentioned anything about the address or the phone she was supposed to send.
I haven’t responded to her yet because I have no idea how to answer. I’m also a bit shaken up about it.
What would be the best course of action here? I also dated a girl two days ago just to see how I feel. Not sure if that’s relevant but I thought I’d add that information.September 17, 2020 at 4:06 pm #115521
@soupcat Reply by telling her you’re doing okay and seeing a psychologist in order to work through your work stress. Do NOT ask about a phone number, but write; “If you want me to send your things, I’ll need an address”. Also you might wish her the best..
How did the date go with the new girl? Are you going to see her again?September 17, 2020 at 7:12 pm #115522
@patricia12 I said I was doing ok and asked her if she’s also ok. She then accidentally called me. I tried calling back but then she hung up and said she felt emotionally unprepared. But she would be ok with calling tomorrow. So we scheduled a call all of a sudden.
I wasn’t expecting this and I said “yeah if that’s what you want”. Now I don’t know what is happening and why we are calling actually. I think it’s just to catch up or something? But I’ll tell her about the psychologist during that phone call and how I’ve been doing meditation.
I’m really flustered now and I’m doing my best to stay calm, which is working, but is there anything else I should say on the phone call? I so badly want to know how she is doing but I don’t know how ready she is to open up to me about her things. I assume that I should NOT mention getting back together or the breakup or how I still love her? Or is it ok to mention “Honestly, a part of me still wants you back but I’m okay with whatever happens. I understand why we broke up and I’ve learned a lot from it.”
Should I mention that how I felt this breakup was definitely necessary for us to grow? Because in all honesty, it really feels like a good thing because it was going so bad for a while. And we needed this break. I just wish that now that we are growing, we can rekindle in the future. When I have my drivers license and finances and savings in order. And finished the sessions with the psychologist. And when she feels ready to handle the world on her own. But at this point in time I have no idea what she’s going through and how she feels. Is this a friendship call? Am I slowly being friend zoned?
And the date went great only I think I’ll have to call it off because I’m definitely not ready for another relationship and she seems very much in love with me already.
Thank you so much for your quick response. I hope it goes well tomorrow and I’m not expecting anything out of it. It’s so nice that she finally reached out to me on her own terms, which she never even did during our relationship. She just seems so fragile and I really don’t want to fuck this up anymore than I already have. She is the sweetest girl I have ever met and I took her for granted because I felt entitled and I will never forgive myself for letting this happen. I hope I’m not making things harder for me to move on by interacting with her. Everywhere on the internet they say “stay away from your ex!” but I can’t help it. We were young and naïve and had no emotional maturity and I feel like we can fix this if she’s willing.
What if it’s a phone call to tell me we should never speak again?September 18, 2020 at 6:11 pm #115524
@soupcat When she said was ok with calling tomorrow, you said; ““yeah if that’s what you want” My gosh, you should have just said “Okay”
Try not to speculate as to what the call is about or what she will say. Just take it as it comes and reply appropriately to whatever she says. But do NOT say ““Honestly, a part of me still wants you back but I’m okay with whatever happens. I understand why we broke up and I’ve learned a lot from it.” She already knows you want her back!! If she mentions the breakup, you could say you understand why she broke up with you and you’re learning a lot. But don’t bring up the breakup if she doesn’t! Otherwise, let this be a friendly casual call. Nobody but her knows if she’s trying to put you in the friend zone and it’s too early to determine. Be kind and polite. You need to change the impression she has of you, so listen to her.
You could ask how she’s doing with her therapy. And of course let her know you’re seeing a psychologist mostly for work stress. If the conversation is short, don’t worry about it, just let it flow naturally and don’t push her on anything.September 18, 2020 at 6:44 pm #115526
Thank you again for your reply. You have proven again to be very insightful about all of this. I truly appreciate all support you have given me. It has been a tough time for me and talking to you seems like it is helping me a lot. Weather it is to reconcile or to move on.
We finished the phone call a few hours ago and it went very well. She mentioned how she has gotten a job a month ago, how she started studying, and looking for her own apartment even. I was very happy to hear that. I got a bit concerned because friends and family around me were filling my head with ideas that she would not do well. I told her that I so happy to hear she’s doing well and I was concerned about her. I also asked about her job and what she does now.
I mentioned my psychologist and how I’ve been keeping my emotions under control through meditation. She briefly asked how my family is doing and I mentioned how she no longer should worry about it. I apologized again for the boundaries that got broken with my mother and sister. She responded with something like “Don’t let it get you again”. I think she was implying that the next relationship I shouldn’t let my family issues get in the way. Its kind of a complicated issue but I made clear that I am VERY aware of how my mother intruded in our relationship and that those are big FAUX PAS in a relationships and I will not let it happen again.
We also talked about other things like COVID, friends, and what I’ve been up to. Kind of. Everything felt very natural and not forced. I never mentioned getting back together or how I still loved her. She said that she wanted to keep talking to me and after being together for so long, it felt weird to not speak to me. I told her that its hard for me but that I’m okay with it. If she felt like talking to me, I’d be there. I think this is where I showed a bit of weakness and showed how heartbroken I was about it. But I could not help myself and wanted to be honest. I didn’t tell her flat out I was heartbroken but I think the tone of the conversation could be felt.
I mentioned that it’s weird to talk to her knowing I wont see her, she said we could still see each other. I said that it’s not really that far. She agreed. It was weird. I don’t know what I was trying to get at here but she was ok with it.
After a while I asked about the stuff she still wanted, she mentioned a mug she was attached to and her engagement dress. I told her I found some other of her things and ship it all together and I’d pay for it. She also said she’d send the phone as soon as she gets her first paycheck. I think we ended things on something casual. She still didn’t send the address through text, so I asked her to send it and how I could maybe visit if I get my drivers license and would do a road trip through Europe. She said it sounds like a good plan.
I don’t know where I stand now in the entire process. I feel like I’ve been pushed back a few steps in recovery. But it felt like I got decent closure as well. It didn’t feel bad and it was nice to hear from her again in a more neutral setting. I’d love to keep talking to her but it feels like I’m giving myself false hope so I’m going to keep everything to a minimum and keep trying to let her do the initiating.
It really sounds like she wants to keep talking to me. So we’ll see how it goes. I don’t know if I feel like moving on. After 8 years, I think I want to take my time to process this.
I hope if I see her again one day. It will be nice.
I didn’t proof read this so I apologize for any mistakes.September 18, 2020 at 10:39 pm #115527
@soupcat Yes, it’ good news to hear she got a job and is looking for an apartment:) What is she studying and where? What phone number are you talking about? Now that you have the address, send the things as soon as you can..
I’m glad you learned the lesson and told her you would never let other grown-ups (family) interfere with a committed loving relationship! I’m sure she’s happy you came to your senses..
It’s a slightly positive sign that she wants to keep talking to you, but do NOT overwhelm her with messages. Let her be the one to next initiate something and then you should answer appropriately. But don’t sound all sad, be upbeat and positive!
“she said we could still see each other. I said that it’s not really that far. She agreed. It was weird. I don’t know what I was trying to get at here but she was ok with it”.
When you said it’s not really that far, it sounded a little anxious and pushy. But now that she knows you would be willing to make the trip to see her, do NOT bring up visiting her again!! I think it will probably take some time before she would be open to an in person visit.
I think overall the conversation went well. And since you two were together for many years, she will most likely be missing you. That’s not to say she will want to get back together, but your chances are better than many others. It seems you have a mature outlook on the situation and I understand you’re not ready to date again yet. That day may come, but in the meantime, focus on yourself. Get your drivers license and enjoy time with family and friends.October 14, 2020 at 11:34 am #115551
It’s been a while, but there’s been a small update and I’d like your input if possible again.
After two weeks the package finally arrived (I think there’s been some delays because of COVID), and I didn’t receive a confirmation from her that it arrived properly. There was some fragile things in there (her favorite mug) and I wasn’t entirely sure if it arrived on the right address (They live in an apartment complex). So after waiting a day or 2 I reached out to her mother. It was also her birthday and we always wished each other happy birthday every year. I have no beef with her and she’s been liking my posts on Facebook for the past weeks. It felt weird if I stopped talking to her. Anyway, I said “Happy birthday! Did the package arrive correctly?”. She thanked me and confirmed that it did.
Then an hour later I receive a message from my ex: “Hey, i got your package. Thank you😊”
The response I’d liked to send would be: “Alright, great! I was afraid the cups would get smashed along the way. It also took longer than I thought.”
I also went on a date yesterday with a different girl who I thought was very attractive and super nice. It felt like I could develop feelings for her. It was nice to know this was still possible.
Is it impolite to not respond to her for this long? I feel like I’m overthinking things. I’ve also been busy with working out, meditating and my own business so I hope she understands that I don’t respond right away.October 14, 2020 at 12:55 pm #115552
I almost forgot to add: I still need to receive the phone from her. I’m still paying for it and I need it. I can’t cancel the plan without getting a fee, and my work is asking for their phone back. I don’t know how to ask for it back without sounding mean or needy or annoying or negative.October 14, 2020 at 1:25 pm #115553
@soupcat Did she get her own apartment yet?? Did you get your drivers license?? Are you still visiting a therapist?? Is your ex still in therapy?? Are you working full time??
If the phone was given to you by your work and they want it back, you have to contact your ex to let her know that. It’s not mean/needy/annoying or negative, it’s just a fact.
Don’t write a long message!! Just say you’re glad the cup arrived intact (period). Then let her know you need the phone because it’s a work phone and they’re asking for it.
Glad you enjoyed the date with the 2nd girl. Maybe continue to explore that and see how it goes over time..
Be careful out there and stay safe! Good luck and keep us posted:)
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